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Government May Nationalize the Auto Industry
- Thread starter Random8145
- Start date
Obviously ^ true, but the fact that the weren't smart enough to know how that would look to "Joe Six Pack" makes me question their ability to successfully lead their companies. I wouldn't even put these guys in charge of PT gear procurement.
Why not? No one could screw up that program anymore than it is.
Fuck the Unions, they are antiquated and hinder good business. When a high school dropout running a rivet machine makes more than a college educated, military trained, twice deployed fucking plane driving LT in the Navy (not me...I'm just a lowly JG) they have been allowed to carry their shit on for too long.
I understand the coal miners need standards, and maybe the people cleaning shit outta hotels should probably have rights too...but when they forget that the BUSINESS they work for is in existence to make a PRODUCT in order to make said business MONEY....they cease to be useful members of society. Ford, GM, Toyota, D-C do not exist to provide people with a paycheck...they exist to make cars to make a profit. Those people get paid to make those cars. The airlines are not in existence to give pilots jobs, they are in existence to ferry people around the country/world for money, the pilots are there to fly those planes. That is why they took their pay-cuts to keep their jobs, they saw the light...UAW will have to figure this out...otherwise they will lose half of their Union dues to unemployment.
I understand the coal miners need standards, and maybe the people cleaning shit outta hotels should probably have rights too...but when they forget that the BUSINESS they work for is in existence to make a PRODUCT in order to make said business MONEY....they cease to be useful members of society. Ford, GM, Toyota, D-C do not exist to provide people with a paycheck...they exist to make cars to make a profit. Those people get paid to make those cars. The airlines are not in existence to give pilots jobs, they are in existence to ferry people around the country/world for money, the pilots are there to fly those planes. That is why they took their pay-cuts to keep their jobs, they saw the light...UAW will have to figure this out...otherwise they will lose half of their Union dues to unemployment.
I LOL'd at this
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dy.../11/19/AR2008111903669.html?hpid=opinionsbox1
especially Roskam's question asked of the witnesses about willingness to work for $1 a year a la Nardelli's offer
PayWatch: Home Depot Stock Stalls Even as CEO Nails Multimillion-Dollar Pension
^^^^^^^^^
http://blog.aflcio.org/2006/04/12/p...even-as-ceo-nails-multimillion-dollar-pension
Then he got a $210m severance package
jackass
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dy.../11/19/AR2008111903669.html?hpid=opinionsbox1
especially Roskam's question asked of the witnesses about willingness to work for $1 a year a la Nardelli's offer
PayWatch: Home Depot Stock Stalls Even as CEO Nails Multimillion-Dollar Pension
^^^^^^^^^
http://blog.aflcio.org/2006/04/12/p...even-as-ceo-nails-multimillion-dollar-pension
Then he got a $210m severance package
jackass
BurghGuy
Master your ego, and you own your destiny.
So is Top Gun, but it still inspired millions, several on this site for that matter... many of which might not have wings benieth their names if not for that movie (search your heart, you know it's true). Behold, the power of fiction.
Not like I'm an obsessed spammer here, just providing a plug for what I thought was a good book that had interesting ideas.
You know part of the problem is that the auto companies have been defining efficiency as raw power. Part of their problem is that they have been creating more and more powerful engines to power all sorts of crazy electronics and many other gadgets that you don't truly need in a car. This truly came to hit them when the gas prices started climbing and people couldn't afford their gas guzzling SUV's and trucks anymore. The car companies never realized that you can define efficiency in MPG until too late. Even now they don't seem to care too much about it.
Then again the average american doesn't seem to care much about it. Most people love driving their huge trucks and SUV's around. Unless gas prices go up, no one seems to notice that other way that cars can be improved. The only focus on raw power. Seriously why does a car need to go 0-60 in 2 seconds... It's a waste.
+1
*Many* unions have crossed into unsafe, highly anti-competitive territory.
Labor unions got their start in this counrty defending children against exploitation by factory owners, that's the kind of stuff they should do. They should not be setting ridiculous, unnatural wages for their members (auto workers, airline workers, or anyone). The reform needs to start with the unions.
Wasn't gonna weigh in but now I need to... Unions do serve a purpose.. They have lost much power and faith over the years do to power, corruption and alernative motivations.. BUT until you are in a position working under a management that is hostile and disingenious towards workers than I think your opinion is inaccurate... On one day last year, OUR mechanics (no union) had there pension plans terminated and put into a different plan (worth less/not guaranteed-of course); they also had there medical premiums doubled without any ability to fight it.. Unions are useful in obtaining a CBA which can only be altered by a court or by vote of the membership... Now unrealistic wages are another topic but they (union and company) agreed either mutually or by arbitration on THOSE wages... So realistic/inflated or not, they are a known cost that management accepted... How about CEO pay, upper level management pay.. Notbody seems cares that they make ungodly dollars??? And they sure have tons of money to keep NASCAR cars on the track... Wonder how much cash it takes to sponsor one of those a year???
It is easy to prejudge a union from the outside but when you are part of one that fights for your job and your collective rights and work rules.... Well...
It is easy to prejudge a union from the outside but when you are part of one that fights for your job and your collective rights and work rules.... Well...
I completely agree, my point is that too many are functioning beyond their intended purpose.
Bum deal. Still, that's how a free market works- there are no guarantees.
This is where you lose me. Just because management agrees to something doesn't mean it's in everyone's best interest. Unions are powerful...that fact that they can force management to concede certain points doesn't mean jack...except that they are too powerful and need to be reformed.
CEO pay is all about the free market. You think they're paid "too much?" In relation to what??
No one likes unions/welfare/regulation until it benefits them.
So, you are telling me that the problem with the auto industry is the extra load put on the engines by the electronic resistance applied by the alternator? What? Pass science class? All of those "gadgets" could run on a 9 volt battery. Those gadgets apply about as much resistance to a 200 horsepower engine as the residual bug guts on your grill.
Maybe I am missing your point, but if your point is that GM's problem is that they built fast/powerful cars, then that's equally nuts. People were buying those cars. It was the recent run up in gas prices that caused people to run away from them. They lost a giant market share the past 6 months, and that what exposed the problems that they were having.
NASCAR is probably the most effective marketing tool for the Big 3. Toyota is doing it, and they are not having money problems. I think you can look elsewhere for the cause. Private jets and money spent on marketing are drops in the bucket. The UAW and failied projects like the "Volt" are bullet holes in the bucket and cash is pouring out.
How is the Volt a failed project? It is still moving forward the last I heard.
Noted. You compared Top Gun to Atlas Shrugged.
Because every one of those cars would have to be sold at a LOSS!!!
Maybe I failed to define terms.
Successful project: cars that can be sold for profit.
Marginal project: cars that you can break even with, or you had a resonable expectation to turn a profit and a market shift caused a modest loss.
Failed project: A car that was designed and planned to be put into production by a company with cash flow problems, with the full knowledge that the car would never be sold for a profit and the company would soak up a significant loss for each unit sold.
Just because they are making the cars (to make stupid ass "Green Politicans" happy) does not make them successful. Charging full speed ahead on a project that you know will lose money is broken business model.
