A lot of people said that in the years leading up to 1914 and then again in the 1930s.
It's a strongly persuasive reason against starting a major war, but on the other hand human nature hasn't changed in thousands of years.
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NEWS If War Comes, Will the U.S. Navy Be Prepared?
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It's a strongly persuasive reason against starting a major war, but on the other hand human nature hasn't changed in thousands of years.
nodropinufaka
Well-Known Member
I feel like I delivered on my analysis.
I said that we have no idea how the conflict plays out with China due to multiple reasons.
I never said TACAIR wasn’t going to be a part. I simply said for all we know TACAIR may not even have a role at all. Because none of us know what’s going to happen.
But everyone here views the conflict from an OPLAN point of view which I suspect why there is so many disagreements. I don’t see a war with China happening in a direct engagement. I stated that if there is any conflict it could be in TWN or some sort of proxy war to which I was told that I was completely wrong and that would never happen.
Diplomacy is one of our governments strongest traits and I think that diplomacy is going to keep the China conflict contained because political will to go fight China doesn’t exist.
Our country just came from 20 years of fighting endless conflicts in the Middle East which we ended up losing.
So I feel politically we will be more inclined to use diplomacy now.
For example our trade and economy with China-
We are intertwined with China at this point. It would devastate our economy stopping.The People's Republic of China
U.S.-China Trade Facts U.S. goods and private services trade with China totaled $579 billion in 2012 (latest data available). Exports totaled $141 billion; Imports totaled $439 billion. The U.S. goods and services trade deficit with China was $298 billion in 2012.ustr.gov
Noting in this report says anything of the sort.
Everyone in the CCMD I worked at before I got out is convinced we’d be at war with China by 2025
See example here:
Can you pick a better example than a three year old opinion piece? I mean, why not this piece that shatters your point of view?
Berger: War With China Not 'An Inevitability,' But Competition Will Endure - USNI News
While the commandant of the Marine Corps has ushered in a slew of changes to prepare the service for potential conflict in the Indo-Pacific region, Gen. David Berger today emphasized that he does not believe war between the U.S. and China is inevitable. Speaking at a Tuesday virtual forum hosted...
news.usni.org
nodropinufaka
Well-Known Member
For one, the opinion piece is by a Harvard International Relations Professor.Noting in this report says anything of the sort.
Can you pick a better example than a three year old opinion piece? I mean, why not this piece that shatters your point of view?
Berger: War With China Not 'An Inevitability,' But Competition Will Endure - USNI News
While the commandant of the Marine Corps has ushered in a slew of changes to prepare the service for potential conflict in the Indo-Pacific region, Gen. David Berger today emphasized that he does not believe war between the U.S. and China is inevitable. Speaking at a Tuesday virtual forum hosted...
The one you posted is interesting too because even the General stated that the TWN conflict could be Asymmetric in nature- which is what I said too.
This is a good statement. It is amazing to me how often we "get our way" when it comes to some really big stuff or at least come to a stable~ish détente.
nodropinufaka
Well-Known Member
A good recent example was our ability to get KJU to come to the negotiating table without the threat of force. No other President or administration before Trump was able to do that.
Really? Say who? By what metric do you measure this? This is among the most pathetic things you have written because “political will” is a thing in a moment. You sound like every other crackpot who tested the US and her allies (they are weak, they don’t have the political will, they are playboys).
Seriously? Once more I ask…says who? Tell us, from your intelligence and academic experience what was the end game of the conflicts in the Middle East? What metric is victory? Why only 20 years? My first taste of combat was in the Middle East in 1983 and we haven’t stopped since. Indeed, we are still fighting in the Middle East. Is “lost” even a metric in a war that is going on 40 plus years?
Harvard? So what, I too have lectured at Harvard. It is still a work of fiction. The article I posted is the perfect example of your flaw in debating this matter…ALL war is asymmetric in nature. If we made a traditional Normandy like landing on the coast of China it would be asymmetrical. In short, it is a meaningless metric.
nodropinufaka
Well-Known Member
You clearly took the political will portion out of context.
What do you mean? We lost the war in Afghanistan. We spent 20 years there and walked out in the middle of the night and the Taliban regained all the control.
We lost Iraq too. Left and then Isis took over. Sure Saddam is gone but they’re not really any better off. And ISIS is out of control.
Same with Vietnam. We lost after years of fighting and the political will of the country didn’t want it anymore.
nodropinufaka
Well-Known Member
Umm. All war is not asymmetric in warfare.
Asymmetric warfare - Wikipedia
If we made a beach landing in China that’s conventional warfare
Conventional warfare - Wikipedia
SNARK! Just SNARK! OK scholar, where did you get your doctorate? Broadly, what was your dissertation topic?
Try again, posting a wiki is the weakest of things to do. Every time I want to believe you, you do something like this. You have a job, I do not question that, but your are neither a scholar nor an academic.Umm. All war is not asymmetric in warfare.
Asymmetric warfare - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
If we made a beach landing in China that’s conventional warfare
Conventional warfare - Wikipedia
nodropinufaka
Well-Known Member
You need to be a scholar to say we lost the war?
Although Jimmy Carter (as statesman and former president) and KJU's grandfather seemed to have an extremely productive dialog- which unfortunately lasted only a few weeks before old Kim suddenly kicked the bucket.
Now, it's a fair argument that Kim Sr. was really just stringing us along but it's also a big question mark in history of what might have been.
But yeah, the DJT and KJU talks were a case of "I did not expect that to actually happen," whatever else was going on behind the scenes with China or anybody else.
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On ISIS, from a real think tank…
Timeline: the Rise, Spread, and Fall of the Islamic State
At its height, the Islamic State - also known as ISIS, ISIL, or Daesh - held about a third of Syria and 40 percent of Iraq. By December 2017 it had lost 95 percent of its territory, including its two biggest properties, Mosul, Iraq's second largest city, and the northern Syrian city of Raqqa...
Another good example that your meaning of “win” and “lose” is rather sophomoric.
If the Taliban Wins the War, Can They Still Lose the Peace?
The United States vowed to destroy the Taliban. Today, they are stronger than ever. But will that last?
foreignpolicy.com
As for Vietnam…
US, Vietnam ties have never been better - Asia Times
Panegyrics were expressed all around when the United States and Vietnam marked the 25th anniversary of diplomatic relations, a remarkable reconciliatory
asiatimes.com
Victory is measured in decades, loss is measured in moments.