International Burn a Qu'ran Day

[OnTopTime]

Of course you didn't, because we have people like this setting the narrative in our media.

Doesn't surprise me; she's a professor at my alma mater, where there's a serious lack of understanding of today's military. I'm not so sure that she sets any kind of narrative, other than what happens in her classroom and her department in a tiny corner of Vermont. It's interesting to see, though, that the chair she holds is named for a guy that taught some of my Poli Sci classes back in the day.

 

[wlawr005]

It's always interesting how our enemies pull the religion card whenever its handy for them. These Korans more being written in by the detainees in order to pass messages, which is probably a form of desecration, yet once they're intercepted, it's our fault for destroying them. Kind of like using a minaret as a sniper platform, then complaining when we return fire at a mosque.

"If against the present one any objection be raised on the score of [the story's] truth, it can only be that its author was an Arab, as lying is a very common propensity with those of that nation; though, as they are such enemies of ours, it is conceivable that there were omissions rather than additions made in the course of it."

Miguel de Cervantes
Don Quixote, 1605

The more things change...

 

[PropStop]

How about this little gem...

http://news.yahoo.com/judge-dismisses-charges-against-muslim-man-attacked-atheist-204051912.html

I don't deny the guy dressed as Muhammad was religiously insensitive, but... REALLY? I don't think this sets a good precedent at all, I hope the case is reviewed at a higher level and this judge is fired for his inability to properly apply the first amendment. ​

By this judge's application of the first amendment, it could be argued a Neo Nazi has every right to attack as a Zombie Hitler because it offends his Neo Nazi beliefs. ​

Freedom of speech only works if you don't squelch speech that offends you. ​

 

[helolumpy]

I don't think they will really learn that much, again - I think it should be read at the level the USMC suggests it. I would hope that a senior officer will have read and/or learned from Sun Tzu prior to being senior officers.

Just as a data point, neither the Army(http://www.history.army.mil/reading.html), Navy(http://www.navyreading.navy.mil/Navy-Reading/Books.aspx) nor Air Force (http://www.af.mil/information/csafreading/index.asp) have Sun Tsu's The Art of War listed on the professional reading list for any paygrade.

Only your service advocates for this book and at the O-1 level (http://www.marines.mil/unit/tecom/mcu/grc/library/Documents/MarineCorpsReadingList2011.pdf).

I know the Naval War College refers to Sun Tsu often, in fact I took the Sun Tsu elective years ago. I would hazard to guess that the other War Colleges (and Command and Staff Colleges) would also use this book often.

I'm curious as to why only the Marine Corps "requires" this book and not the other services... Any one have any thoughts?

 

[Recovering LSO]

To me, it's more in the realm of disposing of trash or destruction of sensitive material. It's not like the green Waste Management recycling truck pulls up to the gate in Bagram to take waste paper to the recycling center.

then why the apology from POTUS, the rhetoric from State, and why is the Pentagon sending officials out to local mosques to apologize? I mean its just trash/sensitive materials?

I'm sticking with my caveman reaction: for a religion as old as theirs, they need to grow the f up and stop acting like petulant children every time some one looks crossways at 'em. and yes, there are christians who would receive the same criticism from me. from a western/christian perspective i thinks the bound paper with "bible" written on it is not that important - individually. burn one in front of me and its not going to change my thoughts on what is written on the page of another one just like it. having some faith in the bigger picture helps people not lose their minds over the small stuff.

apologize.... WTF? let's apologize for killing the other 19 when our high rises ran into 'em.

 

[OnTopTime]

then why the apology from POTUS, the rhetoric from State, and why is the Pentagon sending officials out to local mosques to apologize? I mean its just trash/sensitive materials?

I'm sticking with my caveman reaction: for a religion as old as theirs, they need to grow the f up and stop acting like petulant children every time some one looks crossways at 'em. and yes, there are christians who would receive the same criticism from me. from a western/christian perspective i thinks the bound paper with "bible" written on it is not that important - individually. burn one in front of me and its not going to change my thoughts on what is written on the page of another one just like it. having some faith in the bigger picture helps people not lose their minds over the small stuff.

apologize.... WTF? let's apologize for killing the other 19 when our high rises ran into 'em.

I think that, if Americans weren't in harms way in Afghanistan, none of these "apologies" would have been made. It was likely a pragmatic decision, done to reduce as much as possible the risks to our people over there. Would the violence have been worse if the "apologies" weren't made? Who knows, but I don't think that "apologizing" fanned the flames any further, and doing so possibly mitigated some of the reaction.

 

[Brett327]

^^ This. Agree that Islam writ large needs to get a thicker skin, but we shouldn't be too surprised when a band of unsophisticated goat herders goes ape shit over this kind of thing. We should expect it and craft policies and information campaigns that mitigate it to the extent that that is possible.

Brett

 

[Recovering LSO]

^^ This. Agree that Islam writ large needs to get a thicker skin, but we shouldn't be too surprised when a band of unsophisticated goat herders goes ape shit over this kind of thing. We should expect it and craft policies and information campaigns that mitigate it to the extent that that is possible.

Brett

Wouldn't these policies fail because of the unsophisticated goat herding nature? I'm not being a smart-ass, its a legitimate question. How do you rationalize / negotiate / reason with people who sew young girls shut to prevent "sin" - with people who stone a woman who was brazen enough to get raped - with people who cut each other's heads off for the slightest...?

 

[Brett327]

Wouldn't these policies fail because of the unsophisticated goat herding nature? I'm not being a smart-ass, its a legitimate question. How do you rationalize / negotiate / reason with people who sew young girls shut to prevent "sin" - with people who stone a woman who was brazen enough to get raped - with people who cut each other's heads off for the slightest...?

I'm suggesting that the policies might involve not putting ourselves in a position where we're involved in hearts & minds type fights with completely unreceptive populations. Hindsight is a bitch, but we should have seen this coming.

Brett

 

[revan1013]

If you're the leader of a country, sometimes you are going to make decisions that your people won't like, but are politically necessary. Many leaders see their own people as a hindrance to making intelligent decisions about foreign policy and warfighting. Democracy can be a real bitch if you're the one in behind the desk. You never win. Yeah Obama knows he's gonna piss off a lot of Americans. His priority is minimizing casualties, which he calculated would be higher if he didn't apologize. My guess is he'd rather deal with annoyed people at home, than dead Americans abroad. How much that goes to bite him in the upcoming election... we'll see.

 

[707guy]

then why the apology from POTUS, the rhetoric from State, and why is the Pentagon sending officials out to local mosques to apologize? I mean its just trash/sensitive materials?

I'm sticking with my caveman reaction: for a religion as old as theirs, they need to grow the f up and stop acting like petulant children every time some one looks crossways at 'em. and yes, there are christians who would receive the same criticism from me. from a western/christian perspective i thinks the bound paper with "bible" written on it is not that important - individually. burn one in front of me and its not going to change my thoughts on what is written on the page of another one just like it. having some faith in the bigger picture helps people not lose their minds over the small stuff.

apologize.... WTF? let's apologize for killing the other 19 when our high rises ran into 'em.

I'm suggesting that the policies might involve not putting ourselves in a position where we're involved in hearts & minds type fights with completely unreceptive populations. Hindsight is a bitch, but we should have seen this coming.

Brett

Agreed...

 

[jcj]

As of May, 2011 - 26 murders or attempted murders of ISAF personnel by ANSF or ANP personnel, resulting in 58 deaths of westerners. Of course, there have been more since - including the execution-style murders of two U.S. Military officers in a "secure" area by an Afghan intelligence officer.

Source: http://www.michaelyon-online.com/images/pdf/trust-incompatibility.pdf

The taliban has been decimated & thrown out of power, training camps damaged or destroyed and Bin Laden dead.

Tell me again why we're still over there trying to "nation build"?

 

[scoolbubba]

Because the "nuking the fuck out of a bunch of dirtbag ass hole fuck heads" plan doesn't go over well in diplomatic circles?

 

[squorch2]

"Diplomatic circles" being the rest of the world, yes.

 

[Criminal]

Ok seriously now, lets just leave... No nuking the fuck outa them, just leave. Let them figure it out on their own

Maybe nukem if they find large amounts of oil (cause apparently we don't have any here)