• Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?

    Go here:

    Edit Account Details and Profile

Pilot shortage?

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Welllllll, is there a sports NAPS for skinny nerds who would otherwise be high quality officers? (Of course not.)

Golf. No joke, one of the guys in my reserve unit went to NAPS because he was recruited as a golfer for Annapolis. Showing up a few hours late on his first day with his golf bag in tow endeared him to the staff. Did the max of 28 years as a CDR after 8 on active duty with a few MOB's and other odds and ends in the reserves, I think the Navy got its money's worth out of him.
 

VMO4

Well-Known Member
Wasn't there a significant change in the academic make up of the USNA in the 70's?. I have a good friend who was an enlisted avionics tech in P2V's in the late 60's. He got picked to go to the prep school prior to the Boat School. He was very bright, but the prep school is what they did with E's going to Annapolis. After looking into it he decided to leave the Navy altogether. He ended up returning to civilian life getting a BS and MS in physics and a PhD in statistics, so academics was not his problem. He said he left mostly because the USNA did not offer traditional "majors" in areas he was interested in, but more of majoring in "being in the Navy". His bother graduated from USAFA and they seemed at the time to be more of a traditional broad based academic university.
 

Griz882

Frightening children with the Griz-O-Copter!
pilot
Contributor
Wasn't there a significant change in the academic make up of the USNA in the 70's?. I have a good friend who was an enlisted avionics tech in P2V's in the late 60's. He got picked to go to the prep school prior to the Boat School. He was very bright, but the prep school is what they did with E's going to Annapolis. After looking into it he decided to leave the Navy altogether. He ended up returning to civilian life getting a BS and MS in physics and a PhD in statistics, so academics was not his problem. He said he left mostly because the USNA did not offer traditional "majors" in areas he was interested in, but more of majoring in "being in the Navy". His bother graduated from USAFA and they seemed at the time to be more of a traditional broad based academic university.
Back then, at all the academies, you simply got a Bachelor of Science degree. There was a heavy focus on STEM stuff, but no degrees in History or such. He probably would have gotten his physics jollies satisfied there.
 

picklesuit

Dirty Hinge
pilot
Contributor
I’ll offer a slightly differing opinion...there is more to “best and brightest” than just GPA. I’ve met many leaders who were slightly above average in the classroom, but excelled at motivating, guiding, and inspiring people to get hard things done.

While grades are one indicator of ability, they are not solely predictive. I have seen multiple cases of completely inept Officers who were valedictorian/Summa Cum Laude types.

I think NAPS is a great place to enable someone who has tangible and intangible capabilities to improve their ability to be good at one singular facet of what the Academy requires (schoolwork) in order to take advantage of those other qualities.

That’s from a state school OCS type, so take it for what it’s worth.

Pickle
 

SlickAg

Registered User
pilot
Back then, at all the academies, you simply got a Bachelor of Science degree. There was a heavy focus on STEM stuff, but no degrees in History or such. He probably would have gotten his physics jollies satisfied there.
Not at the Air Force Academy. Sounds like they at least had subject concentrations majors if not full-blown major areas of study in the 60s.


 

croakerfish

Well-Known Member
pilot
How much could it possibly cost to have a bunch of guys live in the disgusting rat holes at OTCN, get taught high school academics by the people you’re already paying to run the other three(?) commissioning programs on site and work out all day? If you get one fleet tour out of them it’s probably worth it.
 

wink

War Hoover NFO.
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
After 20 years as a Blue and Gold Officer, I still can not predict what the Board will do. Seen too many great guys not get selected, and some lesser, though still qualified, get the nod. WRT NAPS, that goes double. I am told NAPS is still primarily for guys coming from the fleet. But for those that find an issue with the very notion of investing more money in a candidate that may not hack it without the extra help, consider that NAPS is a major part of the "diversity" initiatives at USNA. You are not fighting diversity, as it is these days, without getting sideways glances or called names. No different at USNA.

The Foundation Prep programs is still around. They send about 50 guys a year to USNA. Last year NAPS sent 198 to Annapolis. Over 375 came from the fleet last year so obviously, not every fleet guy cycles through NAPS. Notwithstanding red shirt Napsters, I see NAPS as a way to insure candidates who are highly desirable in every other way but possibly academics, succeed at USNA. As has been mentioned, GPA does not make a great leader. But if the Board sees other things on an app that makes the kid's experience indicate leadership chops or a life experience that may enrich the Brigade and even the Navy, why not make sure they will succeed? I tell my candidates it is a back handed compliment. They could have been rejected out of hand, but the Board sees something in them worth the extra investment. How do you measure intangibles? Start with everything but a HS GPA or SAT score and you are likely to get a read on the intangibles.
 

SELRES_AMDO

Well-Known Member
How much could it possibly cost to have a bunch of guys live in the disgusting rat holes at OTCN, get taught high school academics by the people you’re already paying to run the other three(?) commissioning programs on site and work out all day? If you get one fleet tour out of them it’s probably worth it.
Seriously.

With the amount of stupid crap the Navy wastes money on, NAPS seems like a strange thing to be concerned about. The amount the Navy spends on NAPS is a rounding error in their total budget.
 

DanMa1156

Is it baseball season yet?
pilot
Contributor
The Foundation Prep programs is still around. They send about 50 guys a year to USNA. Last year NAPS sent 198 to Annapolis. Over 375 came from the fleet last year so obviously, not every fleet guy cycles through NAPS.

I had to double check you and was SHOCKED at that number as when I went through in the Mid-2000s I could have sworn the number was more like a couple dozen per class, and almost all of them came from Nuke Power School, who got pulled aside and were told "ah, no, you belong at USNA not here."

What's this stat mean? If they didn't come from the fleet directly or NAPS, where did they come from out of the 379 of them?
"This figure includes 19 who entered directly from the Fleet (17 Navy, 1 USMC), and 61 from the Naval Academy Prep School (47 USN, 14 USMC)."

If a third + of the class is prior E at this point, that's really substantial and fantastic, in my opinion, and likely reason to keep NAPS around.
 
Last edited:

robav8r

Well-Known Member
None
Contributor
I’ll offer a slightly differing opinion...there is more to “best and brightest” than just GPA. I’ve met many leaders who were slightly above average in the classroom, but excelled at motivating, guiding, and inspiring people to get hard things done.

While grades are one indicator of ability, they are not solely predictive. I have seen multiple cases of completely inept Officers who were valedictorian/Summa Cum Laude types.

I think NAPS is a great place to enable someone who has tangible and intangible capabilities to improve their ability to be good at one singular facet of what the Academy requires (schoolwork) in order to take advantage of those other qualities.

That’s from a state school OCS type, so take it for what it’s worth.

Pickle
The Mustang Community would agree with you . . . .
 
Top