President Obama's Military

[robav8r]

If I wanted to play army, I would have joined the fucking army.

MB - concur. But you know, the beautiful thing here is that smart LT's trying to weigh their options of staying in or getting out will allow there bullshit sack to get only so full until they just drop it and say c-ya !!! I think the current state of the economy is creating a false sense of stability wrt manning & retention. I know many who have radically altered their career plans or just said "screw it" because of IA's, let alone the normal, everday BS of being in the military.

 

[bunk22]

IAs are just more of the do more with less, which eventually becomes do everything with nothing.

If I wanted to play army, I would have joined the fucking army.

Big leaders need to sack up and go to the appropriate people "We covered for the Army in their time of need, why the hell have they not been able to unfvck themselves in the last 6 years?"

To me, the IA/GSA is like food stamps to the Army. In principle, it's supposed to be a little help to let you get back up on your feet (and eventually get off them) but instead they start planing their "family budget" (read as manning) around having the "food stamps" (IA Bodies to fill billets) and spend the money (manpower) elsewhere.

Agreed. I was given exactly one choice for my post shore tour, Iraq. Well okay, two, Afghanistan as well. Maybe it's timing/community thing but we have an IP who just returned from Bahrain for a year. Another spent a year in Diego Garcia. I get I'm cannon fodder and rightfully so at this point of my career. Better to take me than a JO going to shore duty or an O-4 going to his DH tour. Oh yeah, the IA thing was hung over our head as DH's the entire time I was at VRC-30. The CO at the time (currently 120's CO) finally manned up and selected a guy who f'ed up at the squadron. Heard the same thing quite a bit, there is a war going on. Okay, then why didn't our battle group deploy to this war on both of my last two deployments? Some say it's part of the GWOT campaign. I'll buy that. Then our pilots and personnel are needed in other areas. I just feel the priorities are absolutely skewed, especially after talking to placement about it.

 

[MasterBates]

The only real time I'm gonna have an IA billet in my future is my SuperJo tour. As a retread/RAG student I have been "untouchable", and my contract is up as soon as my DH tour is over. Unless they want to blow over half my DH tour on an IA, which I don't put beyond them.

They'll just call it something other than IA, but it will be an IA.

 

[sevenhelmet]

They won't blow half your DH tour. They'll extend it by the same amount of time as your IA tour, and force you to stay in until your orders are up.

 

[bunk22]

They won't blow half your DH tour. They'll extend it by the same amount of time as your IA tour, and force you to stay in until your orders are up.

Even better, deploy for 6 to 18 months then get back and deploy again for 6+ months, maybe more. Sounds like a good deal for those selected. I was lucky and didn't have that happen but I certainly feel for those who do. A good friend of mine had that happen to him (Marine). Went to Iraq on an IA for 6 months when he got to his squadron. He did what he referred to as secretarial work than an E-4 could have done for 6 months and now is about to deploy for 5-8 months with his squadron. There has to be a better way to utilize our guys on an IA if they are going to be sent. Maybe my EWO job will be worth it.

 

[FLYTPAY]

Why not activate National and Air National Guardsmen to fill the Army and AF's shortcomings? That would be a better solution than IA's. Before you know it we will have another retention problem here in the Navy.

 

[Mumbles]

Still waiting on the written orders, but I accepted the flying GSA billet out of Bagram this morning. Sounds about as good as it's going to get. HJ is supposed to fill me in on it tomorrow over lunch in Pentagon City. Flash said he might crash it as well because he's trying to get the same.

 

[Flash]

Why not activate National and Air National Guardsmen to fill the Army and AF's shortcomings? That would be a better solution than IA's. Before you know it we will have another retention problem here in the Navy.

It is already looming. The active duty SWO LT who relieved me yesterday from reserve duty showed me a community brief for SWO JO's. They are looking at a 40-50% shortfall from the O's that are required to fill billets in his YG. It is looking just as bad for O-4/5 SWO's. That is with the 75k they are throwing at them for the DH bonus. He and the other LT have had enough shenanigans and are both leaving at the end of their initial commitment, and avoidiing the reserves at all costs.

I think the Navy has reached the bottom of the barrel when it comes to the goodwill and tolerance that most have for us being at war for the past 7 years. We were facing a manning crisis right before 9/11 and I think we will again. Starting that vicious cycle where the guys left will have to do more, driving those left out at a faster rate, repeat cycle.

There are some guys that will always stay in, and some that will always get out, no matter the conditions. But a lot of the fence sitters are being driven away by the continued games that the Navy plays. I see it in the reserves now, lots of good guys leaving or not even joining because of it.

The train is coming, and I don't think big Navy sees it yet.

 

[OUSOONER]

It is already looming. The active duty SWO LT who relieved me yesterday from reserve duty showed me a community brief for SWO JO's. They are looking at a 40-50% shortfall from the O's that are required to fill billets in his YG. It is looking just as bad for O-4/5 SWO's. That is with the 75k they are throwing at them for the DH bonus. He and the other LT have had enough shenanigans and are both leaving at the end of their initial commitment, and avoidiing the reserves at all costs.

I think the Navy has reached the bottom of the barrel when it comes to the goodwill and tolerance that most have for us being at war for the past 7 years. We were facing a manning crisis right before 9/11 and I think we will again. Starting that vicious cycle where the guys left will have to do more, driving those left out at a faster rate, repeat cycle.

There are some guys that will always stay in, and some that will always get out, no matter the conditions. But a lot of the fence sitters are being driven away by the continued games that the Navy plays. I see it in the reserves now, lots of good guys leaving or not even joining because of it.

The train is coming, and I don't think big Navy sees it yet.

I'm asking this because I'm curious not because I'm challenging what you just posted.

Why just a month ago was everyone talking about the overmanning of JO's and how people were getting their walking papers instead of being re-designated? Couldn't they just send them to SWO-land? Is the SWO community wanting to not be seen as a community where people who attrite from their previous community can be sent?

 

[squorch2]

Overmanning of O-1s and O-2s is vastly different than undermanning of O-3s, especially O-3s and junior O-4s who are coming up on the end of their commitments. One of them is the normal pendulum of PERS and recruiting while the other is directly related to Big Navy shenanigans such as IA/GSA.

 

[CommodoreMid]

My uneducated guess there is that we have a shortfall of officers at the LT/LCDR/CDR level and a surplus at the ENS level and, as such, we are forced to cut those at the bottom yet are scrambling to keep those higher up because it's not a one for one situation.

 

[Flash]

I'm asking this because I'm curious not because I'm challenging what you just posted.

Why just a month ago was everyone talking about the overmanning of JO's and how people were getting their walking papers instead of being re-designated? Couldn't they just send them to SWO-land? Is the SWO community wanting to not be seen as a community where people who attrite from their previous community can be sent?

A lot of it is be year group dependent. They might be overmanned with YG08 and 09 people but they would have a dearth of people for YG03 and 04. The only way to get people into a YG that late is transitions from people already in the Navy, and who is going to transition to SWO?

The irony is that they might have the same problem with YG's 08/09, and then they will be undermanned when they need DH's. But they only have so much room on ships. And it is the Navy, we make personnel choices harder than they ever should be and they often make no sense.

Flash said he might crash it as well because he's trying to get the same.

Shhhh, I am just there for the beer and meat!

 

[FrankTheTank]

Found this applicable! Looks like lots of Reserve folks on the hook... I have the list of names if anybody needs it.. PM me!

-----Original Message-----
From: *******,
Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 17:51
To:
Subject: OSO Mailbag - Ready Mobilization Pool v.2

Good Afternoon OSO's,

As promised, the Ready Mob Pool (corrected copy), FAQ's and Business
Rules. Please ensure widest distribution.

BACKGROUND:

1. Fallout rates for officers over the past couple years have been
unacceptably high, resulting in gapped billets in theater. CNRFC has
been requested by NAVCENT to implement measures to reduce these rates.
In theory, this pool will reduce fallout rates by pre-screening
personnel and ensuring the right people are ready to go.

2. This pool will provide some stability and predictability for
officers. Instead of keeping all approx 5K URL officers on pins and
needles each year we have narrowed it down to 600. All others have been
given a fair amount of certainty that they will not mobilize this year.


3. Provides visibility on potential mobilizations to OSO and supported
command. Should reduce conflicts between ADSW and mobilizations. Gives
latitude for substitutions within NR unit or BSO.

4. Provides NOSCs advanced notice so member screening can be completed
earlier and can be more in depth.

5. The list provides a pretty good deal for those actually identified.
If they have a one time, limited extenuating circumstance, they can make
it known and instead of mobilizing randomly we can mobilize early or
late to best match availability. Member can also try to get swapped out
within the unit if another officer is willing to swap and if CO concurs.
Provides head's up so officers can be prepared to turnover NR duties.

ACTION:

1. Attached are the candidates for mobilization from April 2009 through
March 2010. Members on this list are required to be screened per the
ECRC checklist. Members can expect to be mobilized in the order in
which they appear on this list, subject to requirements, clearance, etc.


2. Screening is required to be complete NLT 02 March. Business rules
and FAQ's are also attached. Send all sceening results to *******

3. Please notify each individual assigned to your command that they are
on this list and can expect to receive orders to mobilize between April
2009 and March 2010. Standard 60 day minimum notification will apply in
most cases.

4. Following POCs apply:

******
******
******

 

[bert]

The train is coming, and I don't think big Navy sees it yet.

From my perspective, I think everybody sees the train, they just don't know how to get off the tracks. I do think the move away from GSA's to IA's is good in the sense that it will force our manning issues more out in the open. (No more units with a theoretically acceptable 90% manning that actually have x number of folks unavailable on IA's). Of course, a guy on a GSA with follow on PCS orders to a unit can be counted as a fill, so the shell game can still be played with the numbers if Big Navy wants to.

The simple fact is that there not enough bodies to go around, and inevitably what people see as "good" jobs (i.e. ones that people want to fill and would promote retention/morale of the person in them) =/= Big Navy's idea of good jobs (things various folks with stars on their collars have committed to fill like GSA's, joint staff cubicle hell, etc).

 

[zoomie08]

Here's a dumb question. What does GSA stand for? Out of context, I figure it is something similar to IA. I googled it but there are a ton of GSA acronyms out there.