Quick to punch out?

[Coota0]

or your canopy was blown off accidentally. Both cases make it very hard to fly,

Not if you're Harmon Rabb, he can put it down on the boat without the canopy, and land a Tomcat on the boat from the backseat!

 

[TXHusker05]

Not if you're Harmon Rabb, he can put it down on the boat without the canopy, and land a Tomcat on the boat from the backseat!

And use his wing to push the wing of another Tomcat past 45 degrees to take it out of autopilot because the pilot and RIO were out cold (For you Tomcat guys, can that even work?)

 

[phrogdriver]

And use his wing to push the wing of another Tomcat past 45 degrees to take it out of autopilot because the pilot and RIO were out cold (For you Tomcat guys, can that even work?)

If they were both unconscious, wouldn't he want the autopilot to stay on? I, thankfully, didn't see that episode.

Don't know the F-14 in particular, but I know that the flight director in my aircraft will kick off in the affected channel if it goes beyond error tolerances. Usually this is due to the pilot manipulating the controls, vice someone trying to tilt me with his wing, however.

 

[Lawman]

If they were both unconscious, wouldn't he want the autopilot to stay on? I, thankfully, didn't see that episode.

Don't know the F-14 in particular, but I know that the flight director in my aircraft will kick off in the affected channel if it goes beyond error tolerances. Usually this is due to the pilot manipulating the controls, vice someone trying to tilt me with his wing, however.

Both Crew were suffering from hypoxia and passed out. The theory was get the auto pilot off and the plane will decend (in a very violent and probably unrecoverable way if you've ever been unconcious you know why) and the pilot would regain conciousness and recover.

Now how a pair of seasoned winged aviators would not recognize the early to mid stages of hypoxia and decend the aircraft to a lower altitude I have no idea. But hey thats what you get from a show produced by a former Air Force medical guy.

 

[HeyJoe]

Both Crew were suffering from hypoxia and passed out. The theory was get the auto pilot off and the plane will decend (in a very violent and probably unrecoverable way if you've ever been unconcious you know why) and the pilot would regain conciousness and recover.

Now how a pair of seasoned winged aviators would not recognize the early to mid stages of hypoxia and decend the damn plane I have no idea. But hey thats what you get from a show produced by a former Air Force medical guy.

I didn't comment earlier because TV and movie plots are often rooted in fantasy after they run out of ideas. As to seasoned aviators recognizing hypoxia, if you haven't been to the altitude chamber yet and experienced it yourself, hypoxia is usually accompanied by mild sense of euphoria and well-being. That is why it is so dangerous. A Tomcat was lost when the aircrew went off oxygen and were goofing off wearing their garrison covers to show off to their lead. If cockpit pressurization fails and mishap report believes it did in this case, hypoxia can cause you to pass out with inevitable result. There is at least one and maybe more Hornet mishaps where cockpit pressurization is suspected as cause. You'll see how dangerous it is in the chamber.

 

[Lawman]

I didn't comment earlier because TV and movie plots are often rooted in fantasy after they run out of ideas. As to seasoned aviators recognizing hypoxia, if you haven't been to the altitude chamber yet and experienced it yourself, hypoxia is usually accompanied by mild sense of euphoria and well-being. That is why it is so dangerous. A Tomcat was lost when the aircrew went off oxygen and were goofing off wearing their garrison covers to show off to their lead. If cockpit pressurization fails and mishap report believes it did in this case, hypoxia can cause you to pass out with inevitable result. There is at least one and maybe more Hornet mishaps where cockpit pressurization is suspected as cause. You'll see how dangerous it is in the chamber.

Oh Ive experianced it before in the chamber at Wright Patt, that was a fun CAP trip. And while yes I did experiance a mild euphoric feeling (I likened it to Hypothermia without the whole cold part) I recognized that something was wrong. I thought that was the whole purpose in the chamber to teach aircrews to recognize and react to the situation.

 

[HeyJoe]

Oh Ive experianced it before in the chamber at Wright Patt, that was a fun CAP trip. And while yes I did experiance a mild euphoric feeling (I likened it to Hypothermia without the whole cold part) I recognized that something was wrong. I thought that was the whole purpose in the chamber to teach aircrews to recognize and react to the situation.

Hopefully yes, but when you're not expecting it, it can and has been fatal.

 

[mules83]

A good example of unoticed hypoxia is the Lear accident with Payne Stewart.

And talking about punching out, im punching out of Daytona for pcola wednesday.... about FREAKING time!!

 

[TXHusker05]

Both Crew were suffering from hypoxia and passed out. The theory was get the auto pilot off and the plane will decend (in a very violent and probably unrecoverable way if you've ever been unconcious you know why) and the pilot would regain conciousness and recover.

Now how a pair of seasoned winged aviators would not recognize the early to mid stages of hypoxia and decend the aircraft to a lower altitude I have no idea. But hey thats what you get from a show produced by a former Air Force medical guy.

Yea it was some fancy story about cracked O-rings in the oxygen with titanium something in it and the two aviators up and passed out. Then when the great Harm tipped their wing, the Tomcat went into a steep dive and the aviators magically wake up and are fully alert to recover the Cat. Having been unconcious once or twice in my time (one from football, one from... well college), you get all alert when you wake up. You feel like hell. But all the realism aside, great show

 

[MIDNJAC]

Oh Ive experianced it before in the chamber at Wright Patt, that was a fun CAP trip. And while yes I did experiance a mild euphoric feeling (I likened it to Hypothermia without the whole cold part) I recognized that something was wrong. I thought that was the whole purpose in the chamber to teach aircrews to recognize and react to the situation.

yeah, I would have to say that in the chamber you know for sure that something is wrong. When I rode down at JSC in Houston, the only thing that I noticed was a sense of drowsiness......nothing like the symptoms that they claimed most of us would experience. Had I not known what was going on, my guess is that I would not have done anything about it. If I learned one thing from the chamber that day, it is that anyone can get hypoxia and not know it. Maybe your experience was different, but I can understand from my experience why some seasoned military aviators might succumb to hypoxia if it caught them by surprise.

 

[feddoc]

I didn't comment earlier because TV and movie plots are often rooted in fantasy after they run out of ideas. As to seasoned aviators recognizing hypoxia, if you haven't been to the altitude chamber yet and experienced it yourself, hypoxia is usually accompanied by mild sense of euphoria and well-being. That is why it is so dangerous. A Tomcat was lost when the aircrew went off oxygen and were goofing off wearing their garrison covers to show off to their lead. If cockpit pressurization fails and mishap report believes it did in this case, hypoxia can cause you to pass out with inevitable result. There is at least one and maybe more Hornet mishaps where cockpit pressurization is suspected as cause. You'll see how dangerous it is in the chamber.

Continuing with the threadjack....The LPC as we know it will very soon be out of the picture for all pointy nosed guys.

This new procedure will eliminate any chance for DCS and/or barotrauma. It also provides a more accurate hypoxia experience.


Here is a picture of the display panel you will be looking at.

Comes complete with rudder, stick and throttle controls.

Here is a read from the company who makes the electronics which tell the device how/when to apply the (sometimes mixed) gas. http://www.environics.com/robd.html

Pensacola and Lemoore already have it in place. ....for jet folks only; prop folks will have to wait. Other sites will get it soon.

 

[A4sForever]

Hypoxia?

You are generally clueless in the altitude chamber. That's the point of the exercise -- to demonstrate how hypoxia can creep up on you undetected. When "we" went through the various chambers on our way to FREEDOM .... the individual(s) selected to be made the "example" never knew what hit them.

Patty-cake, patty-cake, baker's man .... OUT! .... and then when they strap the mask back on you --- you wonder how in the hell your shoes and socks got removed and placed neatly beside you ... .... the chamber is a great place to fart, however.

 

[HAL Pilot]

....the chamber is a great place to fart, however.

From what I remember, farting was highly encouraged.....

"In the chamber you will see a surgeon's rubber glove expand as you ascend. The gasses inside your body do the same. This expansion of your gases can be quite painful if not handled properly. Upper gas are expelled orally and lower gases are expelled anally......"

I love a job where they teach you burping and farting are accepted procedures .

 

[nittany03]

Another thing to keep in mind WRT so-called "zero-zero" ejection seats (I'm late, I know) is that the "zero-zero" specification only applies to a perfectly level aircraft with zero sink rate. No clue what the numbers are in a fleet a/c, but a T-45 in a fully developed spin at a sink rate of roughly 16,000 fpm will depart the safe ejection envelope at something much more that zero agl. This also applies to bank angle, which is why we are taught if an aircraft is uncontrollable aboard ship to eject before a wheel leaves the deck.

That's kind of the definition of OCF... though I know what you're saying. Lots of gray areas.

Wasn't there and haven't heard the story before, but I would imagine the "Stud slumped over stick" EP would be more similar to a trim runaway than actual OCF . . . as the AOA isn't excessive and control inputs will affect the aircraft, the only precondition being having to muscle the guy in front off the stick first.

 

[Fly Navy]

Wasn't there and haven't heard the story before, but I would imagine the "Stud slumped over stick" EP would be more similar to a trim runaway than actual OCF . . . as the AOA isn't excessive and control inputs will affect the aircraft, the only precondition being having to muscle the guy in front off the stick first.

It would all depend how he's slumped over the stick I guess.