The Eyes have it - All things Vision-related

[DBM]

20/40 is the cutoff for uncorrected vision.
If you are less than 20/20 uncorrected but 20/40 uncorrected or better, you will be given glasses.

Ok then, thank you.

 

[mutanttrout100]

Hey y'all,

Applying for an SNA slot and failed the depth perception portion at MEPS, so recruiter sent me to an ophthalmologist to get checked out/reverified. Passed the depth perception test with the RANDOT there but found out I had latent hyperopia (far sightedness) that my vision self corrects for to 20/20 both near and far. According to the ophthalmologist the autorefractor said my diopter was +2.75, which looking at the physical standards is right below the limit of +3.00. However, I'm slightly confused how this would apply to me, as the standards also says a manifest refraction is not required if a candidate's visual acuity is 20/20. Would this pose an issue as an applicant? I believe based on the applicant physical standards I would be qualified for a slot due to my current 20/20 vision. However, the main reason I'm worried is that I've heard that during the cycloplegic refraction they do at OCS tends to increase the diopter from the regular autorefractor, which may potentially put me over the +3.0 limit and disqualify me at OCS. Is this +3.0 limit based on what's found during cycloplegic refraction, or what's required to get your visual acuity to 20/20?

Thanks a lot guys

 

[exNavyOffRec]

Hey y'all,

Applying for an SNA slot and failed the depth perception portion at MEPS, so recruiter sent me to an ophthalmologist to get checked out/reverified. Passed the depth perception test with the RANDOT there but found out I had latent hyperopia (far sightedness) that my vision self corrects for to 20/20 both near and far. According to the ophthalmologist the autorefractor said my diopter was +2.75, which looking at the physical standards is right below the limit of +3.00. However, I'm slightly confused how this would apply to me, as the standards also says a manifest refraction is not required if a candidate's visual acuity is 20/20. Would this pose an issue as an applicant? I believe based on the applicant physical standards I would be qualified for a slot due to my current 20/20 vision. However, the main reason I'm worried is that I've heard that during the cycloplegic refraction they do at OCS tends to increase the diopter from the regular autorefractor, which may potentially put me over the +3.0 limit and disqualify me at OCS. Is this +3.0 limit based on what's found during cycloplegic refraction, or what's required to get your visual acuity to 20/20?

Thanks a lot guys

What is your uncorrected vision? 20/30? 20/40? 20/100?

 

[mutanttrout100]

What is your uncorrected vision? 20/30? 20/40? 20/100?

Uncorrected 20/20

 

[mutanttrout100]

Giving y'all a bit of an update, went to an optometrist to get a cycloplegic refraction for my own peace of mind and ended up with the following prescriptions:

Cycloplegic refraction:
OD +3.00 -0.75 x 006 20/15
OS +2.75 -1.00 x 172 20/15
Manifest:
OD +2.50 -0.5 x 010 20/15
OS +2.50 -0.75 x 173 20/15
Vision no rx (uncorrected):
R: 20/15
L: 20/15

which seems to put me right at the +3.00 limit for the cycloplegic refraction in my right eye. While I'm happy that I'm currently qualified for SNA, I can't help but worry a bit to see if I am somehow above +3.00 at OCS a year down the line if I will get the NAMI Whammy, even though my vision is still actually 20/15 uncorrected. Anyone have any advice/anecdotes to ease my mind? Or know if there is a chance for a waiver of the +3.00 standard if I am somehow over at OCS, given I have 20/15 uncorrected vision? I've scoured the entire forum and haven't found anyone in a similar situation.

 

[MotorCookie]

Giving y'all a bit of an update, went to an optometrist to get a cycloplegic refraction for my own peace of mind and ended up with the following prescriptions:

Cycloplegic refraction:
OD +3.00 -0.75 x 006 20/15
OS +2.75 -1.00 x 172 20/15
Manifest:
OD +2.50 -0.5 x 010 20/15
OS +2.50 -0.75 x 173 20/15
Vision no rx (uncorrected):
R: 20/15
L: 20/15

which seems to put me right at the +3.00 limit for the cycloplegic refraction in my right eye. While I'm happy that I'm currently qualified for SNA, I can't help but worry a bit to see if I am somehow above +3.00 at OCS a year down the line if I will get the NAMI Whammy, even though my vision is still actually 20/15 uncorrected. Anyone have any advice/anecdotes to ease my mind? Or know if there is a chance for a waiver of the +3.00 standard if I am somehow over at OCS, given I have 20/15 uncorrected vision? I've scoured the entire forum and haven't found anyone in a similar situation.

I have been in your position before, except my eyes were on the opposite end of the spectrum. My eyes were both -8.00 which is the max limit. I had PRK done and everything was ok.

Luckily for you, I am 90% sure that the Navy Refractive Limits are in SE (spherical equivalent). To find your SE you need to use the following formula: Sphere + Cylinder/2

If my math is correct, your SE for your eyes are +2.625 and +2.25, which is within the limits.

However, depending on a lot of factors, your eye measurement can indeed change. There has been a time when a doctor measured my eyes as -7.75 and another time as -8.50. That is a huge difference.

I recommend printing out the NAMI eye standards for aviation and taking them to an ophthalmologist and getting your eyes tested again. The doctor will be able to tell you for certain if you meet the standards or not. Optometrists are great but make sure you see an ophthalmologist instead.

And if possible, look into getting LASIK or PRK, because your eyes will change over time.

 

[mutanttrout100]

I have been in your position before, except my eyes were on the opposite end of the spectrum. My eyes were both -8.00 which is the max limit. I had PRK done and everything was ok.

Luckily for you, I am 90% sure that the Navy Refractive Limits are in SE (spherical equivalent). To find your SE you need to use the following formula: Sphere + Cylinder/2

If my math is correct, your SE for your eyes are +2.625 and +2.25, which is within the limits.

However, depending on a lot of factors, your eye measurement can indeed change. There has been a time when a doctor measured my eyes as -7.75 and another time as -8.50. That is a huge difference.

I recommend printing out the NAMI eye standards for aviation and taking them to an ophthalmologist and getting your eyes tested again. The doctor will be able to tell you for certain if you meet the standards or not. Optometrists are great but make sure you see an ophthalmologist instead.

And if possible, look into getting LASIK or PRK, because your eyes will change over time.

Awesome, good to know! Looking more into it, the waiver guide for LASIK definitely says they use spherical equivalents, but it looks like for the cycloplegic refraction for SNA it specifies +3.00 sphere, at least according to the attachment (Unless my interpretation is wrong and by sphere only they actually mean spherical equivalent). Gives me piece of mind that I would still be eligible for LASIK, but still wouldn't want to get it unless it was absolutely necessary as I have 20/15 uncorrected vision already and don't wanna risk the potentially worse side affects/patient outcomes of hyperopic LASIK compared to myopic LASIK. Also just learned I'm cleared by N3M for my application, and it feels weird to potentially derail myself when my only real issue being that I need glasses when they completely numb my eye.

 

[Mouselovr]

Gives me piece of mind that I would still be eligible for LASIK, but still wouldn't want to get it unless it was absolutely necessary as I have 20/15 uncorrected vision already and don't wanna risk the potentially worse side affects/patient outcomes of hyperopic LASIK compared to myopic LASIK. Also just learned I'm cleared by N3M for my application, and it feels weird to potentially derail myself when my only real issue being that I need glasses when they completely numb my eye.

Lasik/PRK are always an option. Once you're in service, they hand the surgery out to SNA's like candy in Pcola if you change your mind.

My eyes are similar to yours, and I didn't want to get surgery for the navy (20/20 with an astigmatism). The corrective lenses aren't bad.

 

[Riker99]

Hey guys, recently had a flight physical done and I passed. However, I struggled on the depth perception one, where you put on the glasses and read which one is sticking out of the row of 3. I was luckly as the administrator helped me on the last 3. Every other test, i passed with flying colors... How worried should I be and any advice?? Again, it was just that test and the last 3 out of 10 that I couldnt tell, I got the other 7 right. Heading out to OCS in Jan for the CG, so just thinking ahead. Thanks!

 

[Mouselovr]

Hey guys, recently had a flight physical done and I passed. However, I struggled on the depth perception one, where you put on the glasses and read which one is sticking out of the row of 3. I was luckly as the administrator helped me on the last 3. Every other test, i passed with flying colors... How worried should I be and any advice?? Again, it was just that test and the last 3 out of 10 that I couldnt tell, I got the other 7 right. Heading out to OCS in Jan for the CG, so just thinking ahead. Thanks!

Theres a magic number published out there. You do not need to be able to read 10/10. I don't think I've been asked to go past the 2nd line since MEPS.

 

[FiveSevenK9]

Hey everyone, I graduated OCS on Nov 8th and have been in TMG since. I just recieved a medical dq for SNA from NAMI as of Nov 22. The letter says "unspecified disorder of cornea H189 Topography out of standards for SNA". Since I was told I had a 50/50 chance for dq back during week 1 of training, I've been doing a lot of research on my issue since then.

I have full 20/20, full depth perception at 40 arc, and full field of view. However, NAMI must think I will go blind due to a potential risk of me developing keratoconus as seen with yellow circles on my topography. It is extremely frustrating when I read how NAMI allows cornea cross linking surgery to prevent this issue in active winged pilots and it has approximately a 95% success rate. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem a waiver or surgery is possible for applicants.

I am currently waiting to see if I can redesignate as NFO since topography is only performed for SNA. How realistic is it for me to hope I can get CXL surgery as an NFO and Lat-transfer to pilot later down the line? I'll wrap up by saying that for anyone pursuing SNA, I highly encourage you to get a flight physical if possible before going to OCS. The admin process of medical is absolutely messed up between OCS and NAMI these days.

Hope to save others from heartbreak.

 

[Mouselovr]

I am currently waiting to see if I can redesignate as NFO since topography is only performed for SNA. How realistic is it for me to hope I can get CXL surgery as an NFO and Lat-transfer to pilot later down the line? I'll wrap up by saying that for anyone pursuing SNA, I highly encourage you to get a flight physical if possible before going to OCS. The admin process of medical is absolutely messed up between OCS and NAMI these days.

Hope to save others from heartbreak.

Sorry to hear about the NAMI whammy. Had some OCS friends DQed in student pool a couple of years ago, and it still hurts my soul…..

In short, yes, if you’re offered NFO, the door to SNA should eventually be available if you become medically qualified. I’d hold my breath as typically “weird eye stuff” is considered a DQ for both pilots or NFOs. Make sure you can confirm this with the flight docs before switching

However, if you join any community and pin, you could POCR (community change) into pilot later.

 

[FiveSevenK9]

Sorry to hear about the NAMI whammy. Had some OCS friends DQed in student pool a couple of years ago, and it still hurts my soul…..

In short, yes, if you’re offered NFO, the door to SNA should eventually be available if you become medically qualified. I’d hold my breath as typically “weird eye stuff” is considered a DQ for both pilots or NFOs. Make sure you can confirm this with the flight docs before switching

However, if you join any community and pin, you could POCR (community change) into pilot later.

I appreciate the quick response lol. This certainly counts as weird eye stuff too. If not NFO do you have any recommendations on communities that are tactically active at least 25% of the time other than SWO? Intel is full for this fiscal year already so I feel like my only options left are Supply or AMDO which I’m not very interested in. Thanks again for your help friend

 

[Mouselovr]

Hard to give an absolute answer.
IP, Subs, Crypto, Nuke, CEC are other possible communities you didn’t list above depending on your education background.

All my peers who redes’ed in OCS or onward turned out for the better.

 

[FiveSevenK9]

Today I just got my full aviation dq. Thank you all for helping me out. I’m now figuring out my next steps from here.