When are you locked into the Navy?

[Steve Wilkins]

Are you saying that in order to give advice about what makes a good officer you have to actually BE an officer??

Yep.

Of course, you're free to speculate all you want on what are good officer traits and what aren't. Hell, feel free to speculate out loud here on the forum just as long as you understand (and ensure others do as well) that you are merely giving your opinion about what you think makes a good/bad officer.

It's not about the uniform. It's about the individual beneath it.

This may come as a shock to you, but I have worked (and I assume others have as well) for officers that were absolutely great at what they did and loved working for them....BUT I did not respect them personally. On the flip side, I have worked for some that I really respected as a person but were not so great to work for. My point: officers are not necessarily representative of the person beneath the uniform.

I've known alot "Officer material" men...military and civilian. I've also known alot of "non-Officer material" men...civilian AND current military Officers. Just because someone wears the uniform doesn't make them legitimate sources of info. And just because someone doesn't wear the uniform doesn't mean that their information is illegit. Over

It's a WHOLE 'nother world when you put those shiny bars on your collar and walk outside for the first time. I am not exaggerating one bit. Your information may not be completely illegit, but it certainly hasn't been put through the pressure cooker yet either. You will gain a different perspective and probably look back at the things you say now and laugh.

 

[raptor10]

Here's some info you guys might like... Little Effort Made to Find Deserters

 

[Flash]

My wife and I have discussed this at great length... There is a definite and noticeable trend among the current JOs... That is - they seem to feel entitled and that they only care about themselves. We've also noticed it among the current crop of midshipmen we sponsor. Is it reality? Or perception? Unfortunately, many of these young men and women haven't figured out yet that perception is reality in the fleet...

I don't think things have changed that much in the past few years, especially since I got in. You will always have people who try and game the system or figure the world owes them a living. I was on middie cruisein Italy with a guy from a big name school who wanted nothing to do with the Navy, except to pay for medical school. He also claimed that many in his unit were only getting school paid for, and that was all. This was at a time when guys at my school were killing themselves to get in. If you read some personal histories from WWII and the Civil War you will find the same thing, guys only in it for themsleves and no one else.

But then again, what would you expect from a generation born of the younger boomers who were spoiled themsleves? That would be A4s generation, we can ask him about it.......

 

[Flash]

Here's some info you guys might like... Little Effort Made to Find Deserters

The 'rise' in desertions is minscule compared to the whole force and is a very minor problem compared to the many other issues we have today. While desertion is despicable, I think the apporpriate effort is being made right now against the offenders. Most of them are not worth much effort, the law has a funny way of catching up to people eventually .

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4618974.stm

 

[RedDog]

This is an excellent correspondence!!

I might have been a lowly enlisted aircrew reservist, however, we, the enlisted, have to deal with the indecisive officer occasionally. This, at times, is a very bad situation. I'm curious? Let's say this guy becomes a pilot. He doesn’t make fighters. He is now a P-3 pilot, Helo pilot, C-2 pilot, C-130 pilot, ect; Commander of an entire aircrew; officer and enlisted. When a critical decision is required, how will he react? Is he capable of making an immediate, split second decision? And living with it, outcome good or bad????

We are at war…… Our men and women with the Gold Wings have to do this every day…….

Now, let’s step out to the civie world…. After he’s served his commitment.

If he couldn’t do it then, with an aircrew that has sworn to die for this country, is aviation where he needs to be? In this situation, he is responsible for civilian lives.

Hmmmmm…..

 

[Kriegadler]

There's an interesting take...

However, I think it may just be a few of the pre-life-changing-decision jitters. When I signed on the dotted line, I was shaking. Has that made me any less decisive? No. People know they can trust me to get the job done. Prime example: I got 1.5 hours sleep last night finishing a project, found out I left a major part out, but because I had worked hard, I had the information I needed. Typed it up this morning, printed it up. Turned it in, finished my classes for the day, and still swam a mile at 1700. I asked the same questions ol' boy is and recieved very similar answers. A lot of officers had to correct my wayward thinking on military service.

Asking the question may be a sign of forward thinking. Weigh the odds now, instead of damage control tomorrow. ORM?

 

[Steve Wilkins]

This is an excellent correspondence!!

I might have been a lowly enlisted aircrew reservist, however, we, the enlisted, have to deal with the indecisive officer occasionally. This, at times, is a very bad situation. I'm curious? Let's say this guy becomes a pilot. He doesn’t make fighters. He is now a P-3 pilot, Helo pilot, C-2 pilot, C-130 pilot, ect; Commander of an entire aircrew; officer and enlisted. When a critical decision is required, how will he react? Is he capable of making an immediate, split second decision? And living with it, outcome good or bad????

We are at war…… Our men and women with the Gold Wings have to do this every day…….

Now, let’s step out to the civie world…. After he’s served his commitment.

If he couldn’t do it then, with an aircrew that has sworn to die for this country, is aviation where he needs to be? In this situation, he is responsible for civilian lives.

Hmmmmm…..

What on earth are you talking about?

 

[Herc_Dude]

Nevermind

 

[Kriegadler]

I had to read that article twice myself. Poor grammar. Somebody got a C in Journalism class.

 

[RedDog]

What on earth are you talking about?

What I am talking about is the integrity of this individual.
That is capable of leading a group of men/ women in to battle. Or, is he the type that would cower at the instance of opposition? Let's look at the pilot of the situation of China. He had to make to crucial, split second decisions.

 

[Single Seat]

Are you saying that in order to give advice about what makes a good officer you have to actually BE an officer??

It's not about the uniform. It's about the individual beneath it.

I've known alot "Officer material" men...military and civilian. I've also known alot of "non-Officer material" men...civilian AND current military Officers. Just because someone wears the uniform doesn't make them legitimate sources of info. And just because someone doesn't wear the uniform doesn't mean that their information is illegit. Over

So according to you, you're not in uniform or even commisioned. By that standard, shut the hell up, you have no idea what you're talking about. You have no idea what "officer material" is.

 

[HeyJoe]

Are you saying that in order to give advice about what makes a good officer you have to actually BE an officer??

After seeing the USAF F-15 in you avatar I was wondering if you stumbled on the wrong forum in the first place (or maybe you didn't know that).

 

[bunk22]

This is an excellent correspondence!!

I might have been a lowly enlisted aircrew reservist, however, we, the enlisted, have to deal with the indecisive officer occasionally. This, at times, is a very bad situation. I'm curious? Let's say this guy becomes a pilot. He doesn’t make fighters. He is now a P-3 pilot, Helo pilot, C-2 pilot, C-130 pilot, ect; Commander of an entire aircrew; officer and enlisted. When a critical decision is required, how will he react? Is he capable of making an immediate, split second decision? And living with it, outcome good or bad????

We are at war…… Our men and women with the Gold Wings have to do this every day…….

Now, let’s step out to the civie world…. After he’s served his commitment.

If he couldn’t do it then, with an aircrew that has sworn to die for this country, is aviation where he needs to be? In this situation, he is responsible for civilian lives.

Hmmmmm…..

Number one, we swear to die for our country? Perhaps willing to risk our lives but swear to die? As for those who didn't get what they want, I would say most settle in to what they have to do. Remember, if something goes wrong, their ass is on the line as well. Saving your ass means saving everyone as well. I'm talking about those few individuals who make it through the process but are upset about their selection and service. Most of us in the C-2 world were not where we wanted to be (including me) but most of us learn that success is doing what you have to as opposed to what you want to. I've seen just a few guys who didn't want to be here and they were weeded out, be it quitting, bad FITREP or FENAB.

 

[A4sForever]

..... with an aircrew that has sworn to die for this country...

Settle down, calm down ... and while I admire your enthusiasm ... I'm going to piggyback on what Bunk just said .... and I know that I never "swore" to die for the good 'ol USA .... I swore to defend and protect it. Nothing about ... "dying" ... although ... that might come with the territory. But it might come with just walking across the street, too ....

Or, if you don't like our viewpoint ... you would probably would listen to Gen. Patton, yes .... ??

You remember the one .... General George S. Patton, Jr. .... 3rd Army Speech - England ..... 31 MAY 1944 - 6th Armored Division:

" ... Now I want you to remember that no bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. You won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country ...." (in part)

 

[e6bflyer]

Let's look at the pilot of the situation of China. He had to make to crucial, split second decisions.

:icon_roll

Riiiiight....

Not exactly the example that I would have used, but...