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Who determines whether someone is flying as pilot or Co Pilot?

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
...If you had a flag URL aboard and he ordered you to, say, change destination - well, presumably he's aboard because you're taking him somewhere, so okay. But otherwise, I can't imagine any flag attempting to 'take command' of a flight in any plausible scenario...

The only community that encounters this scenario regularly that I know of is the E-6/VQ(T) folks. For one of their missions they often fly with a battle staff headed by a GO/FO and apparently they had a few growing pains in the beginning with a few of the GO/FO's telling the crew to do something that wasn't that kosher. That was a while ago though and a more recent E-6 guy in my reserve unit said he didn't have any issues flying with the battle staff folks more recently.
 

Jim123

DD-214 in hand and I'm gonna party like it's 1998
pilot
Royer.

I always thought the HF antenna looked similar to (but not the same as) my grandma's clothes line.
One of my det mates had that switch on for some reason and he broadcast to the world what part of his body was itching that very moment. Well, not exactly the whole world as it was late at night in the Med and just a couple people were listening to that net.
 

Uncle Fester

Robot Pimp
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
The only community that encounters this scenario regularly that I know of is the E-6/VQ(T) folks. For one of their missions they often fly with a battle staff headed by a GO/FO and apparently they had a few growing pains in the beginning with a few of the GO/FO's telling the crew to do something that wasn't that kosher. That was a while ago though and a more recent E-6 guy in my reserve unit said he didn't have any issues flying with the battle staff folks more recently.

You know, I wondered about that, since it's the only scenario I could think of with a GO/FO regularly flying as part of the crew (as opposed to pax). I'm surprised there were growing pains when VQ took over the mission, since the AF had done NEACP/Looking Glass for decades, you'd think that sort of thing would've long since been ironed out.
 

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
You know, I wondered about that, since it's the only scenario I could think of with a GO/FO regularly flying as part of the crew (as opposed to pax). I'm surprised there were growing pains when VQ took over the mission, since the AF had done NEACP/Looking Glass for decades, you'd think that sort of thing would've long since been ironed out.

That came from a few anecdotes from folks who were in the squadrons at the time so take it for what it is worth, from what I know the GO/FO's who fly the mission only do so for a tour of duty so I think the institutional knowledge would have died out pretty quick. I think the E-6 folks were also used to a bit more flexibility than the EC-135 crews when it came to where they could go on missions, coupled with the different service cultures I am not surprised there were some growing pains.
 

mad dog

the 🪨 🗒️ ✂️ champion
pilot
Contributor
One of my det mates had that switch on for some reason and he broadcast to the world what part of his body was itching that very moment. Well, not exactly the whole world as it was late at night in the Med and just a couple people were listening to that net.
One of your det mates? I bet it was you. :D

Just for the record...I found the beryllium lock pin pullers. :D

IMG_5055.JPG
 

ghost

working, working, working ...
pilot
But otherwise, I can't imagine any flag attempting to 'take command' of a flight in any plausible scenario.

I once deployed with a strike group commander (jet pilot) who when scheduled for a PAX transfer would just walk up to a door and have a pilot get out so he could fly. He would have to be convinced to go to the other door if he walked up to where the HAC was sitting. I am pretty sure he wanted NAVFLIRs from the squadron so he could log the flight time. Modifying the flight schedule probably constitutes "taking command."

He would also schedule himself Alert-5s so that he could show he was still "one of the guys" and then after he been sitting for an hour or so call up AB and order to launch the alert.

This guy was an ORM nightmare for the wing.
 

Jim123

DD-214 in hand and I'm gonna party like it's 1998
pilot
One of your det mates? I bet it was you. :D
Nah, not that time. I was one of those guys who would string brevity codes and prowords together into R rated phrases. Or good clean fun, like when we carried the chaplain around and I made the other crewmembers sing "Ahhhhhh" like an angel chorus while I checked in with the different ships as "Holy Helo ___."

Just for the record...I found the beryllium lock pin pullers. :D
Right next to the blade integrity monitors (that we were later told to stop pushing the buttons) :rolleyes:
 

Uncle Fester

Robot Pimp
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
I once deployed with a strike group commander (jet pilot) who when scheduled for a PAX transfer would just walk up to a door and have a pilot get out so he could fly. He would have to be convinced to go to the other door if he walked up to where the HAC was sitting. I am pretty sure he wanted NAVFLIRs from the squadron so he could log the flight time. Modifying the flight schedule probably constitutes "taking command."

He would also schedule himself Alert-5s so that he could show he was still "one of the guys" and then after he been sitting for an hour or so call up AB and order to launch the alert.

This guy was an ORM nightmare for the wing.


Wish I could say I don't believe it, but I've deployed with a CAG like that...
 

jmcquate

Well-Known Member
Contributor
..........when hi-ranking SWOs want a ride.
f14-photo-vf213-21l.jpg
 

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
..........when hi-ranking SWOs want a ride.
f14-photo-vf213-21l.jpg

Later at the O'Club he tried to laugh it off and joked about how he should be getting free drinks, for some odd reason no one else was laughing. Classy!
 

Mr Spenz

"Your brief saved your flight' - every IP
pilot
Very true. I had a few flights in the SH-60B with the Skipper/XO where I was the HAC...felt sort of weird since I was a LTjg or LT...good experience none the less.
You were designated on the schedule and signed for the aircraft. You probably were current on something the Skipper/XO wasn't and they needed to gain currency haha.
 
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