Gaza

[MasterBates]

http://www.irishvillage.ae/HomePage

Spent my last St Paddy's day there. Good country to have fun if you're rich.

I've been told I was thee last St. Paddy's day. I really don't remember much of it.

 

[voodooqueen]

I do like how the media barely/doesn't report when Israel gets bombarded with rockets from their neighbors, yet a single "palestinian" (what does that even mean?) kid who is used as a human shield gets hit with a bullet that the Israelis begrudgingly shoot in response to an attack, and it's plastered all over the media that Israel shoots children. Yeah: Israel, the first world democracy surrounded by barbaric caliphate 3rd world terrorist nations, is in the wrong....

Actually, CNN had some footage of Hamas and their supporters that looked quite psycho, as they jumped about and chanted about killing all the Jews. Then they showed an interview with the Israeli president who is so calm and reasoned. Maybe if you have been watching FAUX News... &

 

[scoober78]

See, this is where Hamas loses me...Israel too...but in this particular case...

Hamas praised the attack, but did not claim responsibility.​

"We told you #IDF that our blessed hands will reach your leaders and soldiers wherever they are," the al Qassam Brigades, the military wing of Hamas, said on Twitter. "You opened the Gates of Hell on Yourselves."​

Just when I think they have a point worth talking about...
The only way to win a war of ideas like this, is to not make it a war of bullets.

Full story here:
http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/21/world/meast/gaza-israel-strike/index.html

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that."
-Martin Luther King, Jr.

 

[Brett327]

I'm with you there. I can only assume that that message is intended for their own internal audience, not us in the West.

 

[usmarinemike]

Actually, CNN had some footage of Hamas and their supporters that looked quite psycho, as they jumped about and chanted about killing all the Jews. Then they showed an interview with the Israeli president who is so calm and reasoned. Maybe if you have been watching FAUX News... &

I thought the same thing reading the NY Times article about the cease fire. The people in Gaza are counting the cease fire as a glorious victory and they count it as a defeat for Israel? As opposed to what? Getting flattened by the Israeli Army? There's so much at work internally there that doesn't really make sense in our western, outsider context.

 

[Brett327]

That's the real tragedy here. The average Palestinian is being used as a pawn by Hamas, ultimately to his detriment. The interview of Khaled Meshaal by Amanpour last night was pretty revealing. Hamas may be transitioning to a "legitimate" political party, but they've got a long way to go before they're ready for prime time. Lots of hate there.

 

[phrogdriver]

You know, the one sure way to free ourselves from foreign oil is to develop biofuels and other alternative energy.

Oh wait, that's pinko-commie hippie talk. Biofuels are part of President Obama's plan to destroy America.

 

[SkywardET]

You know, the one sure way to free ourselves from foreign oil is to develop biofuels and other alternative energy.

Oh wait, that's pinko-commie hippie talk. Biofuels are part of President Obama's plan to destroy America.

You mean the $53 per gallon variety used by the Navy in Green Hornet demonstrations? Yeah, that's independent alright. Independently broke.

Independence is a farce. It's been a national goal since when, the 1950's? At least since Nixon. There's no possibility of it, nor is it going to "solve" any "problems" because such things really don't exist in this context. There are only outcomes and situations, not solutions and problems. But that is a discussion for a more philosophy-inclined debate.

 

[MasterBates]

I'm with you there. I can only assume that that message is intended for their own internal audience, not us in the West.

But if that is their internal message, didn't it prove the point they are essentially acting like medieval savages with 20th century tech?

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[MasterBates]

Nuke power wouldn't cut our energy imports completely, but would put a dent in it. Coal is also something we could use more of, but instead we sell it to the Chinese.

I love how the green weenies will ban our pretty damn clean coal plants, but it only causes 10x the pollution, albeit in China and the third world.

Same goes for refining, smelting, chemicals...

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[Swanee]

You mean the $53 per gallon variety used by the Navy in Green Hornet demonstrations? Yeah, that's independent alright. Independently broke.

That stuff is expensive when you make it in small quantities. Start churning it out and you'll see the price go down dramatically.

 

[Brett327]

But if that is their internal message, didn't it prove the point they are essentially acting like medieval savages with 20th century tech?

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No, it proves that they are a sophisticated, politically calculating actor that understands what motivates the people they're representing. From the Palestinian POV, they have a legitimate grievance against Israel. Obviously, how you view that depends on where you stand. Terror is the tactic they employ because its all they have available to them. It is a mistake to draw broader conclusions about the Palestinian people as a whole because of that. We do so at our own peril.

The grievances on both sides of the conflict will need to be seriously addressed if any progress is to be made. How and when that occurs is the tricky part.

 

[xj220]

If we really want to get into an energy discussion, this chart will provide a good reference to what we actually use and where it goes. Pretty interesting to look at it. I'll have more analysis to follow, just wanted to get this out for starters (also suggest possible thread split for new topic).

 

[MasterBates]

With energy, there is no one grand unified solution, but there are things we can do to reduce petroleum demand, but we don't.

And its all our (political) fault, not technological or resource based problems.

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[xj220]

Here's the thing about oil and petroleum based fuels: they're extremely good at what they do. Let's use gasoline as an example. It provides a lot of power per unit volume (I forgot the exact terminology, specific heat comes to mind), it's cheap, has low volatility, is stable, easy to transport and can be used in anything from large power turbines to lawn mowers. We'll use cars as another example since they're a big usage of fossil fuels. Electric cars are catching on, but they have limited range and limited infrastructure. Same goes for natural gas cars. With electric cars, they take several hours to recharge whereas I can fill up my tank in 5 min. Try weaning yourself off of that.