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Return of Turboprops to CAS role?

R

RHPF

Active Member
pilot
Contributor
bunk22 said:
According to Beechcraft it is not.

http://www.hawkerbeechcraft.com/military/t-6a/not_pc_9.pdf
Click to expand...
From the pdf:
"The Pilatus PC-9 could not win the Joint Primary Aircraft Training System (JPATS) competition for the U.S. Air Force and Navy. However, Hawker Beechcraft Corporation used the PC-9 as its initial platform to determine what type of aircraft was needed "

I read that to mean, the rules in place require that to win we need to both, modify the design (for mission goals), and to satisfy the acquisition requirement. I am pretty sure that MD would say the same about their EADS relationship. Maybe I am missing something and there is more to it?

Edit: As for it being a foreign design, in the words of Seinfeld, "Not that there's anything wrong with that". If it's a good design, it's a good design, the Tucano would be 'in' though under those rules (would have to find someone to modify the design/build it however).
 
Flash

Flash

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bunk22 said:
According to Beechcraft it is not.

http://www.hawkerbeechcraft.com/military/t-6a/not_pc_9.pdf
Click to expand...

It is not built under license but is instead a modification of the basic PC-9 design. It is basically the same airframe with some of the guts being different. When Beechcraft competed the design it was understood it was a 'new' plane and Pilatus would have no control or say who it was marketed too, so it is now a Beechcraft plane. Pilatus now competes against it in trainer aircraft competitions, their latest is the PC-21. They apparently get royalties from T-6A sales.

When you get down to it, it is a Swiss design. Fine by me, may the best plane win.

PC-9M

PC-21
 
bunk22

bunk22

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Flash said:
It is not built under license but is instead a modification of the basic PC-9 design. It is basically the same airframe with some of the guts being different. When Beechcraft competed the design it was understood it was a 'new' plane and Pilatus would have no control or say who it was marketed too, so it is now a Beechcraft plane. Pilatus now competes against it in trainer aircraft competitions, their latest is the PC-21. They apparently get royalties from T-6A sales.

When you get down to it, it is a Swiss design. Fine by me, may the best plane win.

PC-9M

PC-21
Click to expand...

Hey, I could care less, I have no bone in this fight. I'm just stating what Beechcraft does, it isn't a PC-9. It may look 99% exactly like a PC-9, peform 99% like a PC-9 but according to them, it's not a PC-9. It's exactly the same but totally different. Take it up with them :confused: I wouldn't mind flying that PC-21 though. Pound for pound it looks like the best of em all.
 
Flash

Flash

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bunk22 said:
Hey, I could care less, I have no bone in this fight. I'm just stating what Beechcraft does, it isn't a PC-9. It may look 99% exactly like a PC-9, peform 99% like a PC-9 but according to them, it's not a PC-9. It's exactly the same but totally different. Take it up with them :icon_smil
Click to expand...

I got no beef with you, I am just angry at the world! :eek:

I was just clarifying it all for the masses as well as I could, especially the knuckle-dragging types. ;)
 
Uncle Fester

Uncle Fester

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My point wasn't that a "foreign" aircraft couldn't win a contract, we have and do fly plenty of them. My point is that competition has become so venomous lately, politically, that the "taking American jobs!" BS argument will hold things up for years. To whit, the KC-45 and VH-71 programs.
 
wink

wink

War Hoover NFO.
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Flash said:
It is not built under license but is instead a modification of the basic PC-9 design. It is basically the same airframe with some of the guts being different. When Beechcraft competed the design it was understood it was a 'new' plane and Pilatus would have no control or say who it was marketed too, so it is now a Beechcraft plane. Pilatus now competes against it in trainer aircraft competitions, their latest is the PC-21. They apparently get royalties from T-6A sales.

When you get down to it, it is a Swiss design. Fine by me, may the best plane win.

PC-9M

PC-21
Click to expand...
If Raytheon/Beech is paying Pilatus a royalty, then they must have had to do it (Beech isn't a charity for Swiss firms) and they must get something for their payment. Sounds like a license to me.
 
bunk22

bunk22

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As far as single engine turbo props go, this is probably the bad boy

Had some T-6 discussions today with the front office of VT-6 and with my Saudi's. So as I was not flying today, just did some browsing. One of us mods posted some info on the PC-21 in another thread but I found a good write up on a test flight and the only video I could find. This looks like one bad ass ride for a turbo prop. Probably as close as one can get to flying a jet.

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2008/12/02/319516/pc-21-flight-test-fast-learner.html

 
bunk22

bunk22

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NozeMan said:
I can see it now, somebody's first PA solo......
Click to expand...

I think the PC-21 is meant more for an intermediate to advanced trainer. Kind of like the T-2C was but the PC-21 probably has more performance with that 1600shp and modern cockpit.
 
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