MPH
Well-Known Member
This thread reminded me of this video, it took me forever to find it:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=46c_1201408845
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=46c_1201408845
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F-16 pilot angers civilian pilot
- Thread starter bunk22
- Start date
Screamtruth
นักมวย
I thought I remembered reading something in the FAR's about how you are supposed to behave if intercepted, or approached by a military aircraft.
Cannot seem to find anything on the subject, so I may have this all wrong.
The FAA comments did not seem too promising for his case.
Cannot seem to find anything on the subject, so I may have this all wrong.
The FAA comments did not seem too promising for his case.
It's in the FIH. There's a different set of procedures for FAA, ICAO, and other international regions.
Having a guy holding a sword as your avatar makes me think you are a samurai.Having that Hornet as your avatar just confuses me, makes me think you're active duty
[Insert token helo guy/58% joke here]
+1 for the "Golden shower of excellence"urinate your "excellence" on them?!?
2000+ via the AF computation method?
You mean I'm NOT?!?!?Having a guy holding a sword as your avatar makes me think you are a samurai.
I picked that one because I love the show. One of the best single-series anime pieces out there.http://www.realultimatepower.net/ninja/ninja2.htm
I guess I'm delusional!
Coincidence?
A new event has been scheduled. Following is a brief overview of the event:
"APA Wings Safety Program"
Topic: NTSB Part 30 Review & Luke Airspace Operations
On Saturday, April 19, 2008 at 10:00 AM
Location:
Sun Western Flyers Goodyear Airport
1658 S Litchfield Rd.
Goodyear, AZ 85338
Select Number:
WP0718959
Description:
NTSB Part 830 Review & Luke Airspace Operations.
What To Do If Something Bad Happens & Luke Airspace and Operations To Help You Make Sure That Nothing Bad Happens.
A new event has been scheduled. Following is a brief overview of the event:
"APA Wings Safety Program"
Topic: NTSB Part 30 Review & Luke Airspace Operations
On Saturday, April 19, 2008 at 10:00 AM
Location:
Sun Western Flyers Goodyear Airport
1658 S Litchfield Rd.
Goodyear, AZ 85338
Select Number:
WP0718959
Description:
NTSB Part 830 Review & Luke Airspace Operations.
What To Do If Something Bad Happens & Luke Airspace and Operations To Help You Make Sure That Nothing Bad Happens.
Back on topic, here's what really happened. Taken from avweb.com and posted by Luke Viperpilot
"Let me clear up a few things about this incident.
1. The Pilatus and Raytheon Premier both flew through the middle of a 2 v 2 Tactical Intercept Mission
2. The Pilatus pilot flew right through the Blue Air CAP, leading to the first "intercept". The F-16 came no closer than 1000' to the Pilatus verified by the F-16 HUD tape (with radar lock), ACMI track, and civil radar recording.
3. The "intercept" on the Corporate Image Aviation Jet (Raytheon Premier) ocurred as a result of a fast mover (320 KIAS) in the middle of the fight at 16,500. This happened to be the middle of the Red Air altitude block (5-9s). The F-16 came no closer than 600', verified by HUD tape (with radar lock), ACMI track, and civil radar recording.
4. The accounts by both civil pilots of aggressive maneuvering and 10' and 20' spacing by the F-16 pilot we're verified as false by HUD tape and recorded ACMI data.
5. Thankfully the civilian aircraft were seen prior to becoming a further factor to the F-16 training. The F-16 training was terminated as a result of the traffic. Total cost to taxpayer at ~ $8000 per flying hour x 4 F-16s x 1.3 = $41,600 lost + cost of bad press received due to civilians flying through the MOA closest to the world's largest F-16 base + cost of investigation ($ amount yet determined).
For everyone's safety, please don't fly through active MOA's. If we end up with a mid air, we all lose! www.seeandavoid.org"
"Let me clear up a few things about this incident.
1. The Pilatus and Raytheon Premier both flew through the middle of a 2 v 2 Tactical Intercept Mission
2. The Pilatus pilot flew right through the Blue Air CAP, leading to the first "intercept". The F-16 came no closer than 1000' to the Pilatus verified by the F-16 HUD tape (with radar lock), ACMI track, and civil radar recording.
3. The "intercept" on the Corporate Image Aviation Jet (Raytheon Premier) ocurred as a result of a fast mover (320 KIAS) in the middle of the fight at 16,500. This happened to be the middle of the Red Air altitude block (5-9s). The F-16 came no closer than 600', verified by HUD tape (with radar lock), ACMI track, and civil radar recording.
4. The accounts by both civil pilots of aggressive maneuvering and 10' and 20' spacing by the F-16 pilot we're verified as false by HUD tape and recorded ACMI data.
5. Thankfully the civilian aircraft were seen prior to becoming a further factor to the F-16 training. The F-16 training was terminated as a result of the traffic. Total cost to taxpayer at ~ $8000 per flying hour x 4 F-16s x 1.3 = $41,600 lost + cost of bad press received due to civilians flying through the MOA closest to the world's largest F-16 base + cost of investigation ($ amount yet determined).
For everyone's safety, please don't fly through active MOA's. If we end up with a mid air, we all lose! www.seeandavoid.org"
Ah come on. How many ways does it have to be said. What they did was perfectly legal. I may not have done it. It can be argued it ain't smart. But it is legal. If you want to count costs then look at what it costs for airliners just to fly around the web of restricted areas adjacent to White Sands alone. Scheduling this kind of training in a MOA carries the associated costs of working around civ traffic. An alternative is working in a restricted area. The civ guys need to sit down and STFU. They are just advertising to the world they scare too easily. As to our dribble bib wearing friends, I am not surprised they have been proved professional and safe. I never really thought it came off as reported.
Wink,
I think the distaste for GA pilots here is mostly aimed towards their completely outrageous and fabricated testimonies of close aboard flying and harassments, which as those of us that have flown ADR/HUD equiped aircraft know... the tapes don't lie (and have saved our butts numerous times).
Blood-sucking lawyer fag has caused much damage to the AF community and military pilots in general amongst the ignorant public. How do you get that back in this day and age?
I think the distaste for GA pilots here is mostly aimed towards their completely outrageous and fabricated testimonies of close aboard flying and harassments, which as those of us that have flown ADR/HUD equiped aircraft know... the tapes don't lie (and have saved our butts numerous times).
Blood-sucking lawyer fag has caused much damage to the AF community and military pilots in general amongst the ignorant public. How do you get that back in this day and age?
Oh I understand. I agree. But most GA guys would not have bitched like these guys. Seriously, first thing they would have told anyone that would listen was how cool it looked. Second thing they would say is that they felt stupid and hoped they were not a problem.
You have got to be kidding. You honestly think the public gives more respect to what a lawyer says then the USAF! Everyone hates lawyers. The military is one of the most respected institutions in this country. All this cost the USAF is $40K in gas and an incomplete on some intercept training. Not good for big "A" Air Force, but all it means to the pilots is an extra sortie and bag of gas.
You have got to be kidding. You honestly think the public gives more respect to what a lawyer says then the USAF! Everyone hates lawyers. The military is one of the most respected institutions in this country. All this cost the USAF is $40K in gas and an incomplete on some intercept training. Not good for big "A" Air Force, but all it means to the pilots is an extra sortie and bag of gas.
Wink,
I wish I were kidding. You haven't met some of my in-laws and ex-in-laws. There are plenty of Americans who will be voting for Hillary/Obama that are more than glad to cleave on to any disparaging news about our service. My once brother-in-law asked me while visiting why we had to fly so close all the time as a four-ship of Eagles flew overhead of my yard. "That's just uneccesarily dangerous and sorta dumb isn't it?" I tried as nicely as I could tell him how the basic element of any offensive air tactic is the "flight" for all the different reasons... he just didn't get it and thought we did that just to get our kicks.
My sister-in-law seems to think the whole military is based on 20/20 news stories, and till this day most likely believes I live on a base with a gym on par with 24-hour Fitness or Gold's, a golf course on par with Pebble Beach, and my mil fam housing unit is most likely equivalent to something off ocean drive.
These people's idea of what the military is is wholey based on Hollywood and things like Top Gun, Stealth, Broken Arrow, Independence Day, The A-Team, NAS Emeralnd Point, Pensacola Wings of Gold, Magnum P.I., and J.A.G. You can't tell my there's not truth to that?
That's not the truth?!?!
You mean that I won't fly a nuclear equipped F-14 into a giant alien mothership with Goose as my RIO and Mr. T and Harm as my wingmen?
Oh, God.
You have got to be kidding. You honestly think the public gives more respect to what a lawyer says then the USAF! Everyone hates lawyers. The military is one of the most respected institutions in this country. All this cost the USAF is $40K in gas and an incomplete on some intercept training. Not good for big "A" Air Force, but all it means to the pilots is an extra sortie and bag of gas.
I gotta completely agree with Wink on this one, this is really going to change no one's mind either way, just reinforce what they already thought about GA pilots or the military. Some people are always going to be ignorant morons, no matter how you try and reason with them, that includes family.
As for the Luke Viperpilot's response, he is starting to sound like the asshat who complained in the first place.
That's not the truth?!?!
You mean that I won't fly a nuclear equipped F-14 into a giant alien mothership with Goose as my RIO and Mr. T and Harm as my wingmen?
Oh, God.
THAT... and I don't go grocery shopping, out to eat, to the movies, and to my kid's little league games in my whites or khakis (with combo cover mind you). More importantly I don't have a swank loft apartment or live in a coverted third floor wherehouse with a freight elevator that brings my Ducati or '56 Corvette up to my perfectly post-industrial-Ikea decorated living room with aviation artifacts and 60" plasma...
If it were only true
